No Tape ceiling to wall

[Wes]

Maybe I just haven't been around long enough to ever see this until now. We recently purchased a new house that I am gutting and repairing all the mistakes made by the builder that built the house in 76'. Upon removing the drywall we noticed that the corners where the walls meet the ceiling were not taped at all but just caulked!!!! I thought that this was a mistake and they just forgot a wall but it was throughout the house. One of my guys said that two of the people he had worked with in the past did this and said it "was the only way to go, won't crack this way".
I have never heard of this and decided that it was done by people that obviously had no clue what they were doing, am I wrong?

Have you guys ever seen this? Was that ever acceptable? The builder that built the house was known for cutting corners but this is unacceptable, isn't it?

[betterdrywall]

Re: No Tape ceiling to wall

just cheap builder is all ,sounds like the crews were running as fast as they could and hope they made wages. I have heard of things like this but never actually seen it . I would put the blame on the builder . And your guy is definatly wrong , not an acceptable method. If you listen to guys that tell you something like this is perfectly ok , and you actually belive them , then you need to see a doctor. I would just fire the joker for making such a statement . too stupid to be working around me .

[m beezo]

Re: No Tape ceiling to wall

I have seen it. In fact I once read the HUD manual of acceptable practices. In it it stated something to the effect that if joints did not have the tapered edges you could caulk the joint. Caulk can be a pretty strong joint. And why do you see a crack in the joint. Because the joint compound is brittle and movement of any type can cause a crack. A good joint with caulk might just stretch and then go back instead of cracking.

You removing the drywall because you are seeing cracks or for some other reason?

[betterdrywall]

Re: No Tape ceiling to wall

m beezo... Try getting away with this method on a big commercial job . Or a custom home . Tell them what HUD has to say ... It is not an acceptable method at all . If you want caulk apply it before the primer coat , after all angles have been taped .What a job ripping 3 inches off each sheet that meets up along the cieling , just so you dont have to tape . Hey ya know if the folks who make sheetrock want to come up with some board that can be used for this method of just caulking I'm all for it .

[m beezo]

Re: No Tape ceiling to wall

Better,
work on a commercial job or custom home would be much different than a HUD home. House was built in '76. Maybe something to do with the time it was considered a good practice. I never really said it was a good thing to do. I have seen guys who do just a ceiling and do not want or need to do anything to the walls cut the 3 inch taper off so they have a flat ceiling. That piece gets fitted nice and tight to the walls and then gets caulked to the wall. This avoids folding the tape and doing a corner at that joint which means you then have to do a bit more to the wall than a nice caulk joint. Also avoids having to fill the taper when you are doing the taping. Not that hard a thing to figure out to do since almost no room is set up exactly 8 ft, 12 ft 16 ft etc..Almost always have to cut a sheet or two somewhere.

Anyone know if drywall has always had the tapered edges? And has never been tapered on the 4 ft edge? Kind of thought that at one time all edges might have been tapered as a way to help get a smooth finish. I have long thought all the issues with butt joints could be solved with all edges being tapered.

[Wngsprnt50]

Re: No Tape ceiling to wall

I got a couple sheets one time where the tapers were on the wrong side. It was some weird stuff, but the tapers sloped on the backside with a flat front. We used the stuff for patch jobs and removed the tapers. Was too afraid they would blow out screws if we tried to screw it up tight.

[Wes]

Re: No Tape ceiling to wall

Just to clarify, my guy does NOT think this is acceptable. He used to work with some guys that said it was, he never agreed but was the low man on that totem pole so just let them be.

We are removing the drywall to correct the electrical, enlarge rooms, repair termite damage, etc. Would never tear it off just to put it back on.

[frenchie]

Re: No Tape ceiling to wall

And has never been tapered on the 4 ft edge? Kind of thought that at one time all edges might have been tapered as a way to help get a smooth finish. I have long thought all the issues with butt joints could be solved with all edges being tapered.

It'd be impossible to manufacture it that way. Comes out of the rollers as a single long piece 4' wide. They cut it into 8,9,10,12 sheets after.

It's also why DW has a "grain", and hanging horizontal (cross-stud) is stronger that vertical.

[SteveH]

Re: No Tape ceiling to wall

Caulking angles instead of tape is done in Europe..no problem with it at all and is probably better to prevent cracking.

The drywall manufacturers write the codes..yes, the ones who make the joint compound and tape...can you guess why they call for tape and joint compound on the angles?

[Mike from NH]

Re: No Tape ceiling to wall

So they sell more mud...duh!

[Bsmoothe]

Re: No Tape ceiling to wall

Thank God for tape! cause with the framing i follow behind i'd be there all frickin day trying to get corners "caulkable" unless i use the big tube and gun with the nozzle cut to full flow. I think I finally just found the one use for that cordless glue gun i seen at HD the other day

[charles]

Re: No Tape ceiling to wall

What if crown molding is to be installed during trim-out? Would you still think the joint should be taped? And how airtight is caulk compared to tape? If you caulk the joint and then caulk the crown, do you get a foolproof seal?

[Lavrans]

Re: No Tape ceiling to wall

How about fire rating? There's intumescent caulk, of course. I have seen this done, but it was run over old, cracked plaster. Not my favorite- I think if it's bad it should get pulled or repaired, not covered, but finances are finances. D-wallers caulked the seam instead of taping it- looked fine for what it was.

[m beezo]

Re: No Tape ceiling to wall

What if crown molding is to be installed during trim-out? Would you still think the joint should be taped? And how airtight is caulk compared to tape? If you caulk the joint and then caulk the crown, do you get a foolproof seal?

I have seen drywall behind a crown molding that was neither taped or caulked. Not sure it was the right thing to do but that was what I found. Crown was taped to the walls and ceiling. You would have to make sure the crown was large enough to cover the tapered edges on the sheets is about the only thing I am thinking. So some taping might be needed on a couple of walls regardless. And if you have to do half the room then why not do the rest.

[Mike from NH]

Re: No Tape ceiling to wall

I just did a ceiling job 4 large rooms and bathroom on the first floor of the house. The h/o was a finish carpenter so it was all getting 4" crown. So I didn't tape the lid to the walls. And why would you? Fire rating...maybe squirt some fire caulk if you need per code otherwise just let the crown cover it. Besides if the crown is paint grade its getting caulked to the wall and ceiling anyways, so how is that not air tight enough?