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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
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    Default Framing openings for large window group

    Not so large. About 12 feet by 12 feet. See photos attached.

    Six units, six openings. Bottom row is 3 foot sidelite windows, with a 5080 french patio door between. Top row is three transom windows shaped to give a springline arch top.

    As the photos show, there is no more than about 4 inches of trim width between the clad units. Inside, the finished trim needs to cover not only the structural posts and cross members, but most of the jambs of the windows and the door. This makes for a trim board width of 5-1/2 to 6 inches.

    So, do you make the frame of doubled 2x6s? How do you deal with the joints where vertical between-posts meet horizontal between-sticks?

    One of the images is my rendering of the group. In my version, the frame is doubled 2x6 between, both ways.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Framing openings for large window group

    Did some doodling and came up with this, which I'll take to the engineer.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Framing openings for large window group

    I'm curious to know why you chose dimensional lumber for the kingpost and jacks while showing composite members for the interior jambs.

    Structurally, I think you are doing fine. Without any context, I'd say that you are firm and efficient. Thats the same way I typically frame those types of walls. I haven't had any experience yet with the composite timbers.

    I just stood one up this week that is almost identical. I'll post a picture of it. The contrast will be err, interesting, to say the least.

  4. #4
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    Sep 2009
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    Portland, Maine
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    Default Re: Framing openings for large window group

    That seems like it would work just fine, but my guess is that my engineer would propose an LVL for the header and PSL's for the posts rather than LSL's....and all of them.

    And don't forget squash blocks beneath everything at the point loads.
    Portland Renovations, Inc.
    www.portlandrenovations.com

  5. #5
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    Nov 2006
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    Calyfornia
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    729

    Default Re: Framing openings for large window group

    Good question from Jim regarding dimensional/engineered material. The composite stuff will definitely stay straighter but if I did it, somehow, someway the shrinkage difference would come back to bite me. Engineer usually calls out Simpson A35s on all the interior corners too.

    Andy

  6. #6
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    Sep 2012
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    Default Re: Framing openings for large window group

    Thanks to all for looking and commenting. Looking into things a little more, when comparing the LSL material I was considering for the posts and crosses to #2 SYP, I realized I would actually have a stronger frame if doing it all in SYP.

    Southern yellow pine at #2 grade has a MOE of about 1.6 x 10^6, way up at the top, when compared to DF, SPF, and HF. This, compared to the engineered LSL at 1.3. LVL is in another class at 1.9 and higher, but that would be overkill for this.

    So, all will be #2 SYP, and we'll go with the A3 clips at the cross joints.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
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    Houston & Washington Texas
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    12,162

    Default Re: Framing openings for large window group

    My concern in doors-sidelites-transoms is the "shakiness" of the assembly, not the header or cross members, those are easy to handle. I might consider using steel posts to firm everything up.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
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    Martinez, California
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    14,926

    Default Re: Framing openings for large window group

    Quote Originally Posted by Allan Edwards View Post
    My concern in doors-sidelites-transoms is the "shakiness" of the assembly, not the header or cross members, those are easy to handle. I might consider using steel posts to firm everything up.
    Allan:

    I was going to say that too, in our seismic zone that would all be done in steel anyway.
    “It is not an endlessly expanding list of rights —the “right” to an education; the “right” to health care; the “right” to food and housing. That is not freedom. That is dependency. Those are not rights. Those are the rations of slavery – hay and a barn for human cattle.” - Alexis de Tocqueville

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
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    Coachella Valley (Palm Springs CA area)
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    290

    Default Re: Framing openings for large window group

    with our seismic and wind loads we normally end up with a tubular (2"x5" typ) steel
    If you choose not to decide you still have made a choice
    https://rustynail3.com

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
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    Sterling Heights, MI
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    Default Re: Framing openings for large window group

    Quote Originally Posted by Allan Edwards View Post
    My concern in doors-sidelites-transoms is the "shakiness" of the assembly, not the header or cross members, those are easy to handle. I might consider using steel posts to firm everything up.
    I'm also concerned about the shakiness when I frame these gables. I wasn't feeling good about this gable after I laid it out and realized that I only had room for one king stud in between the openings. I debated whether it would be stronger to run the lower header continuous. I opted not too because that would have eliminated my only continuous member from floor to ceiling in the interior of the wall.

    The only saving grace for this wall is the fireplace box, which adds a great deal of stability. Also, when the trusses are set, I will be able to lace the upper section of the wall which will add significant rigidity.

    This is a condo and I have to duplicate this wall and I'm not really sure if I'm going to do it the same, or change it up.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  11. #11
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    Dec 2009
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    Default Re: Framing openings for large window group

    I'm not sure why that picture is rotated. It's not orientated like that on my computer.

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