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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
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    Louisville, KY
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    3,753

    Default Simple Connecting to Masonry Question

    Little debate going today on site.

    Let's say you are attaching a 16g piece of 2x2 angle to a brick veneer wall. Do you put the tapcons into the mortar or actual brick.
    Louisville Exteriors
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  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Boise, Idaho
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    3,154

    Default Re: Simple Connecting to Masonry Question

    What is it for? How much load will it be carrying?
    It is a simple matter of being patient. I do patience very well, except for the waiting part. That's the one aspect of patience that still bites me.

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  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Northwest Indiana
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    Default Re: Simple Connecting to Masonry Question

    How brittle/hard is the brick?

    I have had brick strip the threads off TapCons.

    So, it depends on the situation/product.

    Tom
    http://chicagocraftsmen.org/2011/06/261.html

    Check with the AHJ, what we say doesn't matter.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Georgia
    Posts
    1,794

    Default Re: Simple Connecting to Masonry Question

    I think I asked a similar question maybe 2 years ago. I ended up going thru the mortar joints to the structure behind the brick veneer, and it has held well so far, but not much load to challenge it.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Greensboro, NC
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    1,514

    Default Re: Simple Connecting to Masonry Question

    Tom - you cheated and read the instructions. It - depends / either -or is the answer.
    Steve

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  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Greenville,S.C.
    Posts
    377

    Default Re: Simple Connecting to Masonry Question

    I'm not sure that it matters or you can be sure what is right. As Tom's experienced I've also had Tapcon threads strip in brick . Another consideration is if the brick is cored or not- most are. Then the Tapcon may be hitting air after the first inch or less, when the drill bit breaks out the wall of the brick similar to a BB's effect on the i/s surface of a pane of glass.
    If the Tapcon goes into a mortar joint it's pull out strength will depend on the compressive PSI of the mortar and the depth of the mortar joint in combination with the length & diameter of the Tapcon. I wouldn't depend on the withdrawl strength of a Tapcon in brick or a mortar joint for many applications. In my experience there are few situations where anything structural should be attached to a brick veneer, although it happens quite often. Fastening flashing, signage etc. are safer applications.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Boise, Idaho
    Posts
    550

    Default Re: Simple Connecting to Masonry Question

    Brick veneer cracks easily so I would put it in the joint unless replacing a cracked brick isn't a concern.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Northern Jersey
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    1,283

    Default Re: Simple Connecting to Masonry Question

    I would avoid the brick personally. You could always repoint a mortar joint.
    Tom

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    sonoma ,calif
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    1,813

    Default Re: Simple Connecting to Masonry Question

    tapcons work sometimes but because it is only sometimes i have an assortment of those plastic and led inserts .drill the hole out bigger and tap insert in . I have heard it said the best place was the mortor but right off that seems dumb . I have seen a lot more failed mortor joints then bricks .

  10. #10
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    3

    Default Re: Simple Connecting to Masonry Question

    For tapcons the mortar joints are best for these reasons:
    The brick can be brittle as stated above and you could crack it, if not during installation, perhaps later in life. The mortar should be solid from the face of the brick to the back, but, depending on your brick that may not be the case with the bricks, thus you get less pull out strength. Lastly, the tapcons are engineered to be installed and hold in a cementitious material, i.e. concrete, CMU, or in this case mortar, so you'll have a better overall hold and life, and they will be easier to install, as someone else mentioned too.
    Hope this helps, and who won the debate?
    Good luck,
    Anders

  11. #11
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    151

    Default Re: Simple Connecting to Masonry Question

    I've found the bricke to be more consistant than the mortar.
    But each situation is different. I try a few and see how it is going before comitting.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Danbury area of western CT
    Posts
    4,440

    Default Re: Simple Connecting to Masonry Question

    I just put TapCons into a granite foundation, they did not strip their threads. Are you guys using the correct drill bit size? I've had them strip in concrete when I hit a quartz aggregate stone, but never in a brick. Maybe I just have brick luck.

    Phil
    It's better to try and fail, than fail to try.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Northwest Indiana
    Posts
    5,576

    Default Re: Simple Connecting to Masonry Question

    Quote Originally Posted by philthegreek View Post
    I just put TapCons into a granite foundation, they did not strip their threads. Are you guys using the correct drill bit size? I've had them strip in concrete when I hit a quartz aggregate stone, but never in a brick. Maybe I just have brick luck.

    Phil
    Proper sized drill bit. Fired brick.

    Tom
    http://chicagocraftsmen.org/2011/06/261.html

    Check with the AHJ, what we say doesn't matter.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    5,839

    Default Re: Simple Connecting to Masonry Question

    I don't think a tapcon is the best fastener for that application. My first question would be "What's the load going to be on the angle iron?" I'd probably go with a small diameter sleeve anchor drilled into mortar joint or a Rawl fiber plug if it was carrying a superficial load. A chemical anchor may also work in some cases. like others have said it depends on the brick and the quality of the mortar

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