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  1. #61
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Boise, Idaho
    Posts
    3,154

    Default Re: sill plates overhanging foundation

    Did I miss something, dlhunter? What did the mason do on this job?

    I once had an idiot try to move into a house without paying for it because he claimed he measured the foundation and in a couple places it was off by up 1/8" and he wasn't paying until the errors had been fixed.

    The arbitrator told him to pay or lose the deposit on the house and I could sell the house to the next buyer!
    It is a simple matter of being patient. I do patience very well, except for the waiting part. That's the one aspect of patience that still bites me.

    I'm not saying I'm Superman. What I'm saying is no one has ever seen me and Superman in the same room together.

    ParkWest Homes LLC
    Working Man Online Store
    Living Healthy

  2. #62
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Posts
    4,683

    Default Re: sill plates overhanging foundation

    Quote Originally Posted by parkwest View Post
    Did I miss something, dlhunter? What did the mason do on this job?

    I once had an idiot try to move into a house without paying for it because he claimed he measured the foundation and in a couple places it was off by up 1/8" and he wasn't paying until the errors had been fixed.

    The arbitrator told him to pay or lose the deposit on the house and I could sell the house to the next buyer!
    Ok, Park, you asked in this thread what I saw right off the bat as a key to this whole scenario happening in the first place: How he hired a GC who had to be fired so early in the process.

    Now I'm not taking a shot at you, but I gotta ask... Since this guy you're referring to seems like a total jerk who had just been waiting until the end of the project to bring up some issue about the foundation (since it obviously could have been brought up waaayyy before this)..., how did you end up with someone like this as a customer? Did you see signs he was going to be this way?

    Someone recently told me that some studies have been done on how to spot potential troublesome customers. A very interesting find in that study was that you should run away from anyone who doesn't like dogs.

    I can see that.

    Tom
    1) Unconsciously Incompetent: He knows not, and knows not that he knows not. He is a fool. Shun him.
    2) Consciously Incompetent: He knows not, and knows that he knows not. He is simple. Teach him.
    3) Unconsciously Competent: He knows, and knows not that he knows. He is asleep. Wake him.
    4) Consciously Competent: He knows, and knows that he knows. He is wise. Follow him.

    May we all endeavor to progress from not knowing that we know not, to knowing that we know.

  3. #63
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Colorado Springs, CO
    Posts
    146

    Default Re: sill plates overhanging foundation

    Quote Originally Posted by TSJHD1 View Post

    Someone recently told me that some studies have been done on how to spot potential troublesome customers. A very interesting find in that study was that you should run away from anyone who doesn't like dogs.

    I can see that.

    Tom
    Interesting correlation. On a similar note, I've had several (maybe 4 or 5) potential clients over the years warm right up to me because their dog normally didn't like strangers but liked me right away.

    Then again, maybe it was just the sausage sandwich I had for lunch.

  4. #64
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Boise, Idaho
    Posts
    3,154

    Default Re: sill plates overhanging foundation

    Quote Originally Posted by TSJHD1 View Post
    ..Now I'm not taking a shot at you, but I gotta ask... Since this guy you're referring to seems like a total jerk who had just been waiting until the end of the project to bring up some issue about the foundation (since it obviously could have been brought up waaayyy before this)..., how did you end up with someone like this as a customer? Did you see signs he was going to be this way?...Tom
    If you wait until you find a customer who isn't a drug addict, alcoholic, codependent, mentally and/or emotionally stable, etc. You might only find 12 customers in the whole country. lol

    PLUS, where would the fun be in that?

    Have you ever been in an unhealthy relationship with a woman? I bet that kept you from being bored. lol But you survived and learned from that experience, right? The point being, you might not REALLY know a person until after the honeymoon.

    Seriously, the customer in the above was a younger brother of a high school friend of mine. In the end it was the guy's wife who was looking for an experience similar to her buying shoes on sale at a discount store. She had just graduated from college with a degree in accounting and FELT builder's made too much money compared to what her husband made. sheeesh! At arbitration she proposed she would be willing to pay me $8/hour for every hour I could "justify" to her of me being on the jobsite.
    Last edited by parkwest; 04-10-2012 at 09:59 AM.
    It is a simple matter of being patient. I do patience very well, except for the waiting part. That's the one aspect of patience that still bites me.

    I'm not saying I'm Superman. What I'm saying is no one has ever seen me and Superman in the same room together.

    ParkWest Homes LLC
    Working Man Online Store
    Living Healthy

  5. #65

    Default Re: sill plates overhanging foundation

    Thanks again to everyone for the input on the sill plate overhang. The architect and structural engineer worked out some drawings to ameliroate the problems. Other than the sill plates being off slightly, with these adjustments, everyone feels very confident in the foundation and deck structure. I can post the plan details for the sill plate adjustments if anyone is interested.

    A few questions came up with regards to how the GC was hired for this job, so I thought i would add some details. This is not the first house I have built -- in the past I have had my own home built and financed other housing projects in the area. When I acquired this property, I took the GC from the house I was living in to do some lot "shopping" so we could perform a basic analysis of conservation and site conditions (fill, ledge, watertables, etc.). After I purchased the lot I had an architect come up with a custom set of plans, a structural engineer review/stamp the plans, put together a 20 page spec sheet, and got 6 different estimates.

    One problem I had in picking the GC for this job is what condition the town imposes which have to be done in this order:

    #1 - site plan review
    #2 - site work
    #3 - issue the foundation permit
    #4 - build foundation
    #5 - inspect foundation
    #6 - issue building permit

    The GC who built the house I am living in now recommended his son to me for the site work. I should point that the father did a great job on my house and his son worked as a foreman for that job. For the new house, We paid him $50k for just the foundation which included the footings, rebar, foundation walls, and foundation windows. Excavation and backfill were not part of that price since those were on the site work contract. That was inline with some of the estimates from the other GCs and was not the lowest bid. The first floor deck (if you could call it that) was put on by him as it was required by the structural engineer to fully backfill.

    As for what criteia I used to pick the GC, here is a rough list of what I use in order from highest to lowest

    #1 - licensing status with the state/BBB
    #2 - quality of houses built in the past
    #3 - completeness of estimate (i.e. does it line up with my spec sheet)
    #4 - price
    #5 - responsiveness to estimate and written communication

    Thanks,

    Tim

  6. #66
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Sterling Heights, MI
    Posts
    4,614

    Default Re: sill plates overhanging foundation

    Sorry, this is a repost that was mistakenly posted in the trade talk sidebar

    The (first) framer's big mistake wasn't that he framed it wrong. His mistake was that he didn't immediately check with the site supervisor to determine the solution, once the foundation problem was observed.

    In MI, even the cheapest houses had a brick veneer base that would have hid the minor imperfections in the foundation. If I had to rip out every basement that wasn't perfect, I'd still be working on my first dozen houses LOL!

    I've survived all of the scenarios: building out of square, building square but hanging over/under, adjusting rooms, etc. Each decision must be carefully made. I'd opt for building square 99.99% of the time. I decided that after living in my first house that I framed as an apprentice. I didn't really know how to frame a house yet and I had a lot of help. The foundation was off by a total of 2" on the diagonal measurement and the boss talked me into following the foundation so the siding wouldn't be hanging out in the wind. This house didn't have a brick veneer at the base. That was the worst decision that could have been made. Everything about that house was forever hard to work on.

    My record for framing something out of square was 12" on the diagonals. It was a large commercial building, on a poured footing with 6" block laid for our plates. We didn't need a square to visually know that it was out of square. It was a large gable roof (60' span) and it had 8 reverse gables entrances that projected out with offsets.

    Our first decision was to call the GC and ask him what he wanted to do. It was obvious that everything had to be torn out and redone. He asked us if we could frame on it. Of course we could and that was the decision: just go with it. It turned out that the owner of the building had rejected the GC's foundation contractor and civil engineer and wanted to use his own guys "to make sure things were right" LOL!

    I got pretty good and cutting things out of square to fit together all the soffit systems. I feel pity on the interior guys that had to follow us. I hope they weren't installing any dropped ceilings or laying any floor tiles.

  7. #67
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Des Moines, Iowa
    Posts
    3,817

    Default Re: sill plates overhanging foundation

    Tim

    I am interested in seeing the plan detail for sill adjustment.

    I also wouldn't mind seeing your spec sheet if you would email it to me
    you can find the email by clicking on my name up at the top
    Mark Parlee
    BESI(building envelope science institute) Envelope Inspector
    EDI Certified EIFS Inspector/Moisture Analyst/Quality Control/Building Envelope II
    Level one thermagrapher (Snell Training)
    www.thebuildingconsultant.com
    www.parleebuilders.com
    You build to code, code is the minimum to pass this test. Congratulations your grade is a D-

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