aluminum fascia expansion/contraction

[J Paulsson]

Back in January I hung Rollex aluminum soffit and fascia on my house that I am building in Montana. It was winter, average temp probably low 20s, when I hung it. I used hex head screws with the rubber washers (the sort that you use on metal roofing, etc) shot every 48" up the bottom flange of the fascia, 4 screws total per 12-foot stick of fascia. I also pre-drilled and hand nailed two aluminum exterior trim nails through the face at each fascia overlap, to protect against high wind. FWIW the color of the fascia is bronze, which is basically a moderate grey.
Now that the weather is heating up and we are getting stretches of sustained sunlight, the aluminum fascia is expanding, especially when the sun really hits it directly for sustained periods. I can literally hear the fascia pop and start to buckle when a cloud passes off the sun on a warm morning. In a couple key spots on the south wall it has pushed the dripedge out during expansion cycles and warped it. Needless to say, in the evening when the sun goes down the fascia contracts back to normal. I have seen this before especially on dark color fascia, in areas without trees and high direct sunlight, and especially with larger size fascia (8x as opposed to the standard 6x).
Does anyone have tricks to moderate this? I am wary that during the summer, once the real heat begins, the fascia will look atrocious. Part of me just thinks that if you install aluminum fascia at sub freezing temperatures during the winter (i.e. maximum contraction) then during the hot phase of the year it will reach max expansion, and buckling is guaranteed. This stuff is literally growing like 3/16" in length, maybe even a quarter inch, during the daily warm cycles, and here in Montana we haven't even gone past 60 degrees yet. Any help is most appreciated.

[Mark Parlee]

J
With the screws you trapped the material and did not make allowance fro thermal movement.
Your vinyl and steel siding has slotted holes to allow for this movement.

I you were to slot the bottom edge and nail it on at the slots and tuck the top edge behind the D edge this would allow movement.

[tom struble]

there are other threads addressing this,do a search

[Randy Bush]

Back in January I hung Rollex aluminum soffit and fascia on my house that I am building in Montana. It was winter, average temp probably low 20s, when I hung it. I used hex head screws with the rubber washers (the sort that you use on metal roofing, etc) shot every 48" up the bottom flange of the fascia, 4 screws total per 12-foot stick of fascia. I also pre-drilled and hand nailed two aluminum exterior trim nails through the face at each fascia overlap, to protect against high wind. FWIW the color of the fascia is bronze, which is basically a moderate grey.
Now that the weather is heating up and we are getting stretches of sustained sunlight, the aluminum fascia is expanding, especially when the sun really hits it directly for sustained periods. I can literally hear the fascia pop and start to buckle when a cloud passes off the sun on a warm morning. In a couple key spots on the south wall it has pushed the dripedge out during expansion cycles and warped it. Needless to say, in the evening when the sun goes down the fascia contracts back to normal. I have seen this before especially on dark color fascia, in areas without trees and high direct sunlight, and especially with larger size fascia (8x as opposed to the standard 6x).
Does anyone have tricks to moderate this? I am wary that during the summer, once the real heat begins, the fascia will look atrocious. Part of me just thinks that if you install aluminum fascia at sub freezing temperatures during the winter (i.e. maximum contraction) then during the hot phase of the year it will reach max expansion, and buckling is guaranteed. This stuff is literally growing like 3/16" in length, maybe even a quarter inch, during the daily warm cycles, and here in Montana we haven't even gone past 60 degrees yet. Any help is most appreciated.

First off here in Montana I would never use aluminum fascia. You are right it moves really bad , and when it gets 90- 100 this summer it is going to look ugly. Only real way to solve the problem is to use steel . You will get a little with steel , but not like aluminum. Probably have 6" wide or wider too. Know this is not what you wanted to hear. Once it goes to buckling not much can be done.

[J Paulsson]

Yeah Randy, I am considering different options. I am really wary of how it will look this summer, I'd hate to tear it off and replace it. You might be surprised here in Bozeman how common it is to use Rollex aluminum, for quite a while it has been probably the most common fascia trim system on new construction. Rollex says to use alum nails on the bottom flange every 16 to 24 inches, predrilled slightly larger than diameter of nail shank, and leave them 1/32 loose. Problem is I have done fascia replacements for fascia that is only nailed on bottom flange, with no fasteners in the face, because it tore off in high winds. I am thinking that once I gutter the long level runs on my house the gutters will block a lot of the sun and reduce a lot of the expansion/buckling. The north gable gets little sun so it holds up fine. As for the south gable, ouch... Maybe just contain the buckling with more fasteners until summer and then tear off the old and hang new when its hot. A lot of houses exhibit little or no buckling/waving including ones that I have hung, as far as I can tell the ones with dark and/or larger fascia hung during the cold season develop the worst buckling/waving tendencies.

Maybe I'll look into steel next time, Rollex aluminum has been pretty standard around here for quite a while. IMO the aluminum soffit itself works quite well, its the fascia that is the problem.

[tom struble]

did you nail through both pcs at the seams?,if you did,don't

[J Paulsson]

did you nail through both pcs at the seams?,if you did,don't

Yes I did, thanks for the detail maybe I'll pull them and just move them out a bit away from the overlap.

[tom struble]

are you also having problems with the gable trim,if it's just the eave thats going to have a gutter screwed through it,i wouldn't be too concerned about it.The gutter and over time the finish will dull making it much less noticable

Not the answer you really want to hear but even if they looked perfect just the act of screwing hangers through it will affect it's expansion

[J Paulsson]

are you also having problems with the gable trim,if it's just the eave thats going to have a gutter screwed through it,i wouldn't be too concerned about it.The gutter and over time the finish will dull making it much less noticable

Not the answer you really want to hear but even if they looked perfect just the act of screwing hangers through it will affect it's expansion

The north gable gets almost no sun so it should be fine. East and west flat runs (60 feet long) will get full gutters so that should help out as you say. The south gable (its a ranch house, simple rectangle layout) is having problems, mainly just waves and more heavy buckling at the 2 overlaps. I overlapped by 4 inches on the gables-- probably a bad decision. I'm really just thinking about letting the gutters redeem the east and west level runs and just trying to keep the fascia on the south gable from buckling too much and grossly deforming the dripedge, and then removing the south fascia during the summer and rehanging 4 new pieces mid day when its sunny. Really I think with dark aluminum fascia hung in the winter on a windy hill, I think its almost a guaranteed aesthetic fail. Either the wind tears away at the overlaps and eventually tears the fascia off, or I face fasten and the aluminum expands on sunny/warm days and creates waves and buckling between fasteners.

[Randy Bush]

Just wondering , is there a reason you over lap 4" on the gables? Have you ever checked into Rollex Steel fascia kind of thinking it is as cheap or cheaper then aluminum. My self I use EMCO products out of Billings anthe fascia has been running me like about 10.00 for a 12 footer, I supply all the material when I do a overhang job. Also I nail as little as I have to in the face usually top , middle ,bottom or at a seam. And of course in the bottom flange with # 5 galvanized nails touched up. Colored nails from rollex are not long enough IMO. I also have gone to steel trim coil for my larger garage door caps to stop the warping. The EMCO products now have a ceramic finish now to reflect the heat and so down the warping.

Are things looking better down in Bozeman these days, work wise.

[J Paulsson]

I overlapped four inches because I was hanging it by myself and didn't want to lose a bunch of time measuring precisely, I knew a full stick with a miter at the top would cover it, and didn't suspect that the 4" lap thus created would develop a buckling problem. The more I think about it the more I think predrilling all fasteners is reasonable, even though no one I know around here does it. Up on the second floor it would be very tedious IMO. Anyhow I'm building the house for myself so I'll live with whatever I do.
Here in Bozeman some are getting by chasing the insurance money- siding, or especially roofing. Other than that most of the money is commercial, a little residential work with pretty aggressive bidding and a larger travel radius. On the whole pretty lean.
On a quick search I'm seeing steel/pvc rollex fascia, a bit pricey but might be worth looking into, especially for winter work.

[clydewater]

Take a look at Aluma - Pole. They used to make some double sided vinyl pieces that had slots on them. You nailed them up first, then removed the release paper from the tape and stuck the trim to the tape. In a few hours you could not get the trim off. Since there were slots in the plastic they would slide on the nails that were set loose


here is the link

http://alumapole.com/protrimmain.htm...Pro-Trim-14210

Pro trim Hide - a- nail

[tom struble]

is the gable a 2 step fascia or flat?2 step is more resistant to buckling and gives you the opportunity to nail in the crease,which is preferable to face nailing the flat

flat work fascia requires a little more work to ensure it will stay on and resist buckling

[m beezo]

Tom, I have never seen anyone install fascia like you are showing. Is that your own style or something recommended. I agree that large flat panels are a pain to keep straight. One of my questions is the next piece that overlaps the slotted pieces. How does that get installed and look right. Seems the nails not being tight to the first piece would keep the next piece from laying down nicely. Here what we see is guys use a small punch or awl to enlarge the holes where the nails goe in so the head just barely covers the hole. I guess the thinking is that will allow some expansion and contraction but it is so small I never really thought about it doing a lot of good. And on white I do not see the expansion like I would on the browns which is probably the next most popular color I have used.