Kudos to Andersen

[Mark Parlee]

Re: Kudos to Andersen

Sure

The old ones were crap

Some of their new ones look very promising. Make sure you properly detail the install. Can you remove enough from around the perimeter to get a good weather tape around it?
What are you doing for drainage at the bottom. What is the trim detail at the perimeter?

[Mark Parlee]

Re: Kudos to Andersen

We really ought to start a new thread dedicated to the installation of windows and the crap we have seen and how we are changing things so it does not repeat.

[retro-patrick]

Re: Kudos to Andersen

good idea - done
rP

[Mark Parlee]

Re: Kudos to Andersen

http://forums.jlconline.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=48881

We are moving this discussion about window install details here

[Andrew R.]

Re: Kudos to Andersen

I'm not a huge fan of any clad window but the ones I used on the pictured job are all fixed units on the gable wall. the cladding looks continuous. In the days of EIFS removal , I saw many failures from ganged units and usually we pulled the mulling strip and reset in a bed of silicone. The other thread is so off topic, guess that didn't really work Mark.

[Mark Parlee]

Re: Kudos to Andersen

Andrew
I know it did but I generally think that is going to happen to some extent as it does in regular conversation. I kind of didn't want to distract from your so I thought we start a new one but we can keep discussing various ideas here.
As I was saying I am seeing this problem of the mull draining, actually not a problem it's just that we dam it up when we wrap the windows with trim much in the same way that it happened with the EIFS. Now we are stsrting this thing all over again with the stuccoflex style siding treatments.

[Dick Seibert]

Re: Kudos to Andersen

stuccoflex style siding treatments.

Mark:

What the Hell is that? Not another EIFS, wood flake, or fibercement product?

[Mark Parlee]

Re: Kudos to Andersen

http://www.stuccoflex.com/

There are a lot of EIFS jobs that are done in a MD (moisture drain) type of application that are performing very well. This really is a case of throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

[Dick Seibert]

Re: Kudos to Andersen

Good God Mark, that's elastomeric paint, I've handled dozens of cases, many of the homes were basically destroyed with elastomeric paint. For years the EPA wouldn't allow us to sandblast it off, now they are with copper-slag, I've repeatedly posted pictures of my sandblasting it off a church, it can cost well over $100,000 to sandblast it off the average home, it goes really slow with the approved copper-slag.

Okay, they say: "Stuc-O-Flex is a breathable membrane- 10 -14 perms average (H2O vapor transmission) " is anyone going to believe that after all the elastomeric failures? I've seen horrible mold and mildew buildups in homes, particularly the homes of minorities becasue the crap was sold by high-pressure salesmen who target minorities.

It's interesting how all the failed crap keeps coming back at us in a new generation, it's also interesting that people keep falling for the scams, contractors included, asbestos cement came back as fibercement, hardboard siding has come back in several iterations, flakeboard siding keeps coming back class actions and all, now elastomeric paint is coming back, the siren's song is always "cheaper" and "new", or "new and improved technology", I don't believe that it's going to breathe any better than previous iterations, anybody using it deserves to get sued right out of business. Wake up, the material suppliers are the contractors biggest enemies, they keep flooding the industry with crap, because contractors are gullible and keep falling for the sales pitches and buying it. Look at the crap! (5 second delay) I know, this is new and improved, we made it breathe now, just trust us. You want stucco, install three-coat stucco and pay for it, there just ain't no free lunch in construction or life.

BTW, their drainage mats look okay, I didn't spend much time on them when I saw the elastomeric paint, and it's even bedtime on the west coast now, why did you have to end my day with elastomeric paint? You know how that stuff upsets me.

[Mark Parlee]

Re: Kudos to Andersen

Dick

when this is used the backer board is put over a drainable system
take a look at this
http://www.lpcorp.com/sidingtrim/lps...ccosystem.aspx
They don't specify adding the drain plane but I would not do it without it.