WUI and Decks

[JAlvis]

WUI - Wildfire Urben Interface

Who has experience with WUI and building decks?

The city requires Fire resistant materials for deck projects among other things to avoid fire spreading in WUI areas.

[JAlvis]

Re: WUI and Decks

Posted in wrong Area......can someone move to appropriate location?

Thanks

[Dick Seibert]

Re: WUI and Decks

J:

I'm building in a Wild-lands Urban Interface Area now. Because the code requires all fire-treated wood, and my customer doesn't want any chemically treated wood (he's got two expensive African Wildcats that he doesn't want poisoned) I ended up building stone terraces with rock walls protecting them, the under-floor venting is fire-dampened vents, as are all soffit vents. All exposed wood has to be chemically treated for fire resistance.

This is going to be much more prevalent, United Nations Agenda 21 (signed by Bush I) requires the United States be divided up into 21 Eco-Zones, the rest of the country will be uninhabited Wildlands traversed by bullet trains, expensive homes will be allowed within designated "Interface" between the populated urban cores and the "Wildlands", This is just the start, this 'vision" for the future will not be fully implemented until the beginning of the next century, the only restrictions now in place are fire restrictions, and of course the AHJs make it very difficult and expensive to get permits to build in the Interface.

[frenchie]

Re: WUI and Decks

Dick - Politics and Paranoia belong in TT. Considering your state alone sees almost a billion dollars' in property losses to wildfires a year, I suspect there's a much simpler explanation for WUI rules.


JALvis - No wildfires here, but strict fire codes, because we live so close to each other. No flammable materials within 3 ft of the lot line, 20' wide lots... you see a lot more pavers & patios in backyards, than you do decks.

On rooftops, it's steel beams, so as to bear on the side parapet walls... Joists are usually retardant-treated wood; but I'm curious about this light steel framing that trex is advertising in JLC... Lots of decking options: precast concrete pavers, composite stone pavers... trex & timbertech both have fire-resistant products... Ipe has a pretty good fire rating...

edit:

http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/phot...157915,00.html
http://www.deckmagazine.com/article/45.html

[Dick Seibert]

Re: WUI and Decks

Dick - Politics and Paranoia belong in TT. Considering your state alone sees almost a billion dollars' in property losses to wildfires a year, I suspect there's a much simpler explanation for WUI rules.

Frenchie:

I successfully beat California's Fire Sprinkler, Green, and Wildlands-Urban Interface Codes, but am voluntarily complying with the fire protection provisions of the Wildlands-Urban Interface code because the home is in an area of fire danger. We are now in an agenda of political (Green & Wildlands-Urban Interface) and commercial (Fire Sprinkler) codes, if all the Wildlands-Urban Interface Code mandate was fire protection I wouldn't object, and in fact am complying with those mandates, isn't it strange that they named it "Wildlands" (right out of Agenda 21) and not "Wildfire-Urban Interface Code"? Wildfires and Wildlands are two completely different concepts, Wildlands is a conservation concept, not a fire protection concept.

[MarkMc]

Re: WUI and Decks

Dick you need to write up a CA version of AZ SB1507 and add in a man:beast clause.

[Dick Seibert]

Re: WUI and Decks

Dick you need to write up a CA version of AZ SB1507 and add in a man:beast clause.

Never pass in California Mark, Idaho, Texas, and Arizona yes, "sustainability", "wildlands", and "new urbanism" are key words in the "Communitarian"¹ agenda. The goal is to take away the single family home, the private automobile, and make human beings nothing but tax paying, voting, slaves living in ant-like colonies in a utopian society.

This frankly surprised that a freedom loving state like Idaho would have adopted something like the Wildlands-Urban Interface Code, it's not surprising that a bankrupt socialistic state like California has adopted it.


¹ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communitarianism

[MarkMc]

Re: WUI and Decks

Funny you link to the wiki toolbox on the communitarian agenda.

Why not plato.alma mater? Will they not share risk with you any longer? Do they parse away the intertwininess of the social[istic] aspects of corporatist and pluralist agendae {agendus?}?

Now off to TT lest we ruin our rep's.

[JAlvis]

Re: WUI and Decks

Not really interested in the politics behind the requirements. I have to follow WUI standards to meet the needs of my clients and comply with city standards.

Idaho has adopted stricter fire standards than California. For example California will allow Class B and C rated decking such as Redwood and Cedar while Idaho will only allow Class A decking.

After speaking with Boise City building department they stated Idaho has the ability to stop fires from destroying housing if such ruling is upheld.

The real issue for Idaho is Material. Exterior Fire Rated material is 6-8 weeks out and pushes the pricing to extreme numbers. I'm wondering if anyone has found affordable alternatives to meet WUI standards?

[Dick Seibert]

Re: WUI and Decks

JAlves:

Here is California's publication listing approved products, check and see if Idaho has a similar publication, if not I bet they would approve those products on California's list.

[JAlvis]

Re: WUI and Decks

I showed that publication to the building department and it wasn't of any interest. Each item has to be approved by the fire marshal upon written request.

Its crazy the price increase for this kind of work. The few deck projects that have been built are upwards of $20,000 in materials alone.

The project in Question has already doubled in price from a standard deck.

The one thing I've learned in regards to WUI is Start at the Building Department and then move forward. If you have a project in WUI begin by informing your client that the project will easily be 2-3x the cost in materials. I would also recommend a fee for the numerous meetings with the city required just to build a reliable scope of work to write an Estimate.

[Don_in_Idaho]

Re: WUI and Decks

I ran a fire crew for 10 years and wildland fire has been the term used in the fire fighting industry for much longer than the current interest in urban interface fire fighting and defensible space regulations have existed.

Idaho passes fire regulations quickly in an informed manner since both the state capital and interagency fire center for much of the western us are both located in Boise and someone would have to live under a rock to not know someone in the fire industry there. Of course there are the big fires that wiped out a huge amount of acreage in the not too distant past, but some sagebrush fires that toasted a number of homes really got people's attention a handful of years ago.

When defensible space questions come up with clients in brushy country I remind them that 2' tall sage brush can often put off 100' flame lengths if it's a strong wind driven fire - it's just a fact. Still, I'm amazed that people do so little to protect houses, especially in wooded areas. Flying over urban interface areas ahead of a large fire it's easy to pick out the homes that don't have a chance from over 500' in the air. It takes a lot of crazy regulations to put down in words what a seasoned fire fighter can tell you from intuition based on experience from watching things burn. It's crazy how many regulations law makers think we need to exist in a civilized society!

[JAlvis]

Re: WUI and Decks

Another lesson learned......

The enforcement of WUI is not done by the city building department. The Fire Marshall holds all enforcement and ability to mandate any project.

So don't start with the city.....start with the Fire Marshall.....he has the ability to wave WUI standards. One man having all this unchecked (subjective)power.....seems crazy to me.

[yossar]

Do you have a BML (Building Materials Listing) Service in your state? In California we've been able to spec 2 x 6 Redwood or Cedar decking by citing BML (Building Materials Listing) 8110-2084-00002 from the California Dept of Forestry & Fire Protection, Office of the State Fire Marshall. Perhaps your state may have something similar.