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Scratched Glass

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  • Scratched Glass

    How many builders out there think they know where most scratched glass comes from? I've been doing construction window cleaning for over 40 years and discovered a few years ago, some glass is defective, which scratches when cleaned.

    My company cleans 3500+ homes each year for local and national builders in the San Francisco Bay Area in California and none of my builders pay for scratched defective tempered glass, they send it back for a refund.

    Anyone out there ever heard about defective tempered glass and why it scratches? Anyone want to know more about it?

    Dan Fields
    Dan Fields
    Fields Construction Services, Inc.
    Phone: 800-542-2724 Ext. 201
    E-mail: WindowGuru@Aol.com
    www.StopScratchedGlass.com

  • #2
    Re: Scratched Glass

    Well don't keep us in suspense. Tell us more.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Scratched Glass

      The only scratches on glass that I have encountered were from inexperienced painters who scratched the glass when they sanded the mulls

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Scratched Glass

        Dan,

        We did a whole house remodel a few years back in Mill Valley, your neighborhood. The cleaners at the end of the job used the wrong blade to clean the divided lights (tempered glass) on the French Doors, scratched every one of them.

        Anyway, are you waiting for a subscription fee before you enlighten us? ....start typing...
        Mike

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Scratched Glass

          So what kind of blades are you supposed to use on tempered glass?

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Scratched Glass

            Charles,

            Your question is probably directed to Dan Fields and not me but...

            I know on my job they used a utility knife blade to clean the windows, I think they should have used a single edge blade, but I haven't been cleaning windows for 40 years, currently at the rate of 3500+ homes a year.

            3500 homes annually in the S.F. Bay area, hmmmm... Dick is the window expert, and the S.F. Bay area expert, what say you Dick? (don't mean to force your response, disregard if you're not interested)

            Or better yet, what say you, Dan Fields.

            Mike
            Attached Files

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Scratched Glass

              I did a remodel during which the glass was scratched when the window cleaner used a dry blade to remove the stickers on the new glass. Double pane "heat mirror" glass, very pricey. I paid another guy approx $2500 to polish the noticeable ones out. But the owner still wanted me to replace the glass. According to ANSI standards, the glass was ok. The client said it hurt his eyes to look at the scratches - the only way to see them was to look directly at the sun. To make a long story short, the guy stiffed me for 10K. Lesson . . . Use only insured window washers.

              :-(

              Dave Page
              Dave Page

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Scratched Glass

                Mike:

                I've been waiting for Dan Fields to come back, I've received mailed solicitations from him in the past, and have considered using his company. That many homes indicates that he is ranging far afield into the tracts in the valley areas where low cost homes are still being built.

                I've never known tempered glass to arrive with more scratches than annealed glass, but with the volume that Dan Fields does I can understand the problem. He is also probably cleaning mostly tract houses that use cheap windows, and the degree of care by the cheap window manufacturers may be part of the problem. Personally I use little tempered glass, I use laminated glass instead because it costs little more, and offers better sound proofing, security, and UV ray protection.

                Getting a window cleaning company is tough, many refuse to work for builders because they've told me that builders always accuse them of scratching their glass. Most of our homes are stucco, so there is lots of sand in and around the glass, which can scratch the glass during cleaning. This doesn't explain why Dan is finding more scratched tempered glass than annealed glass though. I also think that the problem with glass cleaners not wanting to work for builders is the fact that builders must obtain certificates of insurance from them, and many of the window cleaners employ illegal labor and can't provide certificates.
                You will ask what goal the U.S. is pursuing? .... their external debt is huge, and ruining other countries is their customary method. Even ownership of the global 'printing press' is no longer helping. Nor is full control over NATO, None of that if enough for the 21st century colonizers. They don't just need to preserve the dollar as the only global currency but also to get their hands on the economic wealth of other large powers and regions. - Sergei Naryshkin

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Scratched Glass

                  Dick,

                  Is laminated glass different than safety glass? Maybe safety glass isn't the proper term I should be using, but I think it is two layers of tempered glass laminated together.

                  We are presently working with our architect to design two exterior guradrails on second story decks. The client wants glass panels so the view to the ocean will not be obstructed. I was considering "safety glass" but was told that unless the edges were somehow sealed from the weather we could get clouding between the two panes of glass.

                  We are considering using 3/8 inch tempered glass panels supported by 2 inch stainless steel tubing for the structure.

                  Any comments on this design?

                  Thanks, Mike

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Scratched Glass

                    Dave,

                    Your story about the scratched glass and the 10K loss hurts just thinking about it.

                    You say the cleaners used a dry blade. We had a glass company replace a french door panel, large single light, and they sprayed window cleaner, from an aerosol can, on the glass before using the single edge blade. I assume wetting the glass in this manner is the correct method.

                    Dan Fields, what say you?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Scratched Glass

                      Mike:

                      Both tempered glass and laminated glass are approved "safety glass", you can use either one. Why are you installing dual pane in deck guard rails? All you need is one pane of safety glass. You only need dual pane for energy conservation, a non-issue on decks unless they are enclosed. I'd use one pane of laminated glass, nobody can fall through laminated glass, but they can with tempered glass, they just don't cut themselves on the glass on the way down.

                      Most car windshields are laminated glass, while the side windows are tempered glass, check the "bugs" in the corners of the windows. I always thought that was so the windshield wouldn't break up into your face in the event of an accident, while allowing you to break-out the side windows to escape (tempered glass shatters into a million pieces when it breaks while not cutting you). This is apparently not so, because Lincoln is now advertising that they are putting laminated glass throughout the new Navigator for superior soundproofing. I guess they just put tempered glass in the balance of the car to save 69¢ (or is it 39¢).
                      You will ask what goal the U.S. is pursuing? .... their external debt is huge, and ruining other countries is their customary method. Even ownership of the global 'printing press' is no longer helping. Nor is full control over NATO, None of that if enough for the 21st century colonizers. They don't just need to preserve the dollar as the only global currency but also to get their hands on the economic wealth of other large powers and regions. - Sergei Naryshkin

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Scratched Glass

                        Dick,

                        I wasn't referring to using dual pane windows for the guard rails. Sorry, I guess I wasn't clear. When I referred to two pieces of glass I was thinking that laminated glass is two pieces of glass with a film between them, not an airspace. Am I incorrect here?

                        Safety glass then is: "tempered glass and laminated glass". I got it. Tempered glass will shatter and fall apart, laminated glass will break but remain intact, more or less.

                        And the price difference between the two is .39 to .69 cents per balance of windows in a Navigator. :-)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Scratched Glass

                          Mike:

                          Sorry, I assumed that you meant dual pane glass from your statement:
                          I was considering "safety glass" but was told that unless the edges were somehow sealed from the weather we could get clouding between the two panes of glass.
                          I have never heard of moisture getting between the glass in laminated glass, and seriously doubt that could happen, it's "glued" together.

                          You got it:
                          Safety glass then is: "tempered glass and laminated glass". I got it. Tempered glass will shatter and fall apart, laminated glass will break but remain intact, more or less.
                          Attached is what happens when you try to break laminated glass.
                          Attached Files
                          You will ask what goal the U.S. is pursuing? .... their external debt is huge, and ruining other countries is their customary method. Even ownership of the global 'printing press' is no longer helping. Nor is full control over NATO, None of that if enough for the 21st century colonizers. They don't just need to preserve the dollar as the only global currency but also to get their hands on the economic wealth of other large powers and regions. - Sergei Naryshkin

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Scratched Glass

                            Dick, the cloudiness happens to car windshields over time. Are laminated house windows constructed differently? Or is the car a more exposed situation?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Scratched Glass

                              Kraig,

                              Sorry I've been out of town on a consultation case (scratched Glass).

                              The glass I refer to is only some tempered glass, poor quality tempered glass. I've gone to the expense to put up a web site, that gets 500+ hits each week, describing the problem in detail. It hasn't made the glass industry very happy, exposing the facts, but builders love it.

                              Check it out: www.StopScratchedGlass.com Give special attention to "The Challenge" section and click on "Quality Glass" for details.

                              Dan Fields
                              Fields Construction Services, Inc.
                              Dan Fields
                              Fields Construction Services, Inc.
                              Phone: 800-542-2724 Ext. 201
                              E-mail: WindowGuru@Aol.com
                              www.StopScratchedGlass.com

                              Comment

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